Debate Guide: Cyclical paternalism - Revision history

The Admins: /* Drug analogy */

2023-01-15T12:04:19Z

Drug analogy

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:04, 15 January 2023
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	==Drug analogy==		==Drug analogy==

	Anti-drugs laws' purported aim is to protect people from intrinsically harmful substances, however it is widely accepted that prohibitions have encouraged drug contamination and poor control of dosing. Within the prohibitionist scheme, drugs education is also incredibly poor, as it is underpinned by the same social-legal misconception of all "drugs" as "bad" (a la Mr. Mackey). No attention is given to identifying the underlying mental imbalances that must exist for a person to become drug dependent. So, because:		Anti-drugs laws' purported aim is to protect people from intrinsically harmful substances, however it is widely accepted that prohibitions have encouraged drug contamination and poor control of dosing. Within the prohibitionist scheme, drugs education is also incredibly poor, as it is underpinned by the same social-legal misconception of all "drugs" as "bad" (a la Mr. Mackey). "Addiction" is wrongly presented as a drug-induced phenomenon, while no attention is given to ''identifying'' the underlying mental imbalances that must exist for a person to become drug dependent. So, because:

	: '''a)''' "Drugs" are taboo.		: '''a)''' "Drugs" are taboo.
	: '''b)''' Young people are rarely informed enough to understand mental imbalances that expose them to a risk of dependency.		: '''b)''' Young people are rarely informed enough to understand mental imbalances that expose them to a risk of dependency.

	~~Young~~ people are then more likely to turn to drugs when they are most depressed and vulnerable. A dependency relationship ensues in later youth or adulthood.		...young people are then more likely to turn to drugs when they are most depressed and vulnerable. A dependency relationship ensues in later youth or adulthood.

	One might conclude that younger people should be allowed to experiment with drug-highs in a supportive and emotionally stable environment. Similarly, guilt-free exploration of body-pleasure (a far less mind-altering event) should be encouraged from an early age, assuming it is on the young person's terms.		One might conclude that younger people should be allowed to experiment with drug-highs in a supportive and emotionally stable environment, as has taken place in some mid-late 20th century communal settings. Similarly, guilt-free exploration of body-pleasure (a far less mind-altering event) should be encouraged from an early age, assuming it is on the young person's terms.

	==Adultism==		==Adultism==

JohnHolt: /* See also */

2021-10-23T15:50:45Z

JohnHolt at 15:47, 23 October 2021

2021-10-23T15:47:37Z

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	This argument is in ~~effect~~ the ~~reverse~~ of ~~the~~ [[~~Debate Guide: Liberty-empowerment\|liberty empowerment~~]] ~~theory and~~ is ~~used to describe how paternalist~~/~~adultist practises in society will sometimes fulfill their supporters' prophecies~~ - ~~creating a demand for their own solutions.~~		__NOTOC__Paternalist/adultist practises in society create "dumb" infantilized minors, who in turn must be treated as vulnerables. This argument (in relation to the concept of [[consent]]) is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li]:

	~~This argument (in relation to the concept of~~ [[~~consent~~]]~~) is summed up by~~ [~~http~~:~~//www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin~~-~~Keung Li~~] on the ~~MHAMic website:~~		[[Image:Li.gif]]

			Cyclical paternalism works in tandem with the [[Debate Guide: Liberty-empowerment\|liberty empowerment]] argument - as they are both essentially different ways of describing the same phenomenon.

			==Drug analogy==

	~~[[Image~~:~~Li.gif]]~~		Anti-drugs laws' purported aim is to protect people from intrinsically harmful substances, however it is widely accepted that prohibitions have encouraged drug contamination and poor control of dosing. Within the prohibitionist scheme, drugs education is also incredibly poor, as it is underpinned by the same social-legal misconception of all "drugs" as "bad" (a la Mr. Mackey). No attention is given to identifying the underlying mental imbalances that must exist for a person to become drug dependent. So, because:

			: '''a)''' "Drugs" are taboo.
			: '''b)''' Young people are rarely informed enough to understand mental imbalances that expose them to a risk of dependency.

	Anti-drugs laws (for example), aim to protect people from harmful substances. However, they have made the use of natural drugs deadly through contamination and poor education surrounding the underlying mental imbalances that must exist for a person to become drug dependent. By simply viewing the drugs as "bad" (a la Mr. Mackey) and something to be avoided, without considering the mental imbalances that put them at risk of dependency, young people are more likely to turn to drugs when they are most depressed and vulnerable. A dependency relationship ensues in later youth or adulthood.		Young people are then more likely to turn to drugs when they are most depressed and vulnerable. A dependency relationship ensues in later youth or adulthood.

	~~To resolve the drug issue, young~~ people ~~must~~ be ~~given a full understanding of their minds, and time~~ to ~~explore their limits - including limited~~ drug ~~use (if sought)~~ - ~~only while~~ in a ~~secure mental state~~ and environment. Similarly, an exploration body-pleasure should be encouraged at an early age, ~~and this should be~~ on the young person's terms~~, with no social guilt or stigma~~.		One might conclude that younger people should be allowed to experiment with drug-highs in a supportive and emotionally stable environment. Similarly, guilt-free exploration of body-pleasure (a far less mind-altering event) should be encouraged from an early age, assuming it is on the young person's terms.

	==Adultism==		==Adultism==

	~~It may be important to consider that the~~ idea of "sexual maturity" is an ''adultist'' concept, imposed on the worlds of minors. What constitutes sexual maturity is defined by the adults who ~~have "attained"~~ it, ~~but critically, those with~~ the power to determine what it is. This elitism can be seen ~~among~~ people like [[Prostasia]]'s Meagan Ingerman<ref>https://prostasia.org/blog/ageplay-is-for-adults/</ref>~~, who professes an~~ interest in "kink and ageplay"~~. She is a typical adultist kink snob/gatekeeper in that~~ she constructs a highly convoluted "adults only" world of ~~subjective~~ deviance for herself, and ~~then withholds virtually every~~ other ~~kind~~ of ~~shared~~ sexual pleasure ~~from minors~~.		The idea of "sexual maturity" (in social terms, at least) is an ''adultist'' concept, imposed on the worlds of minors.

			What constitutes sexual maturity is defined by the very adults who profess it, and have the power to determine what it actually means. This kind of elitism can be seen in the kink-snobbery of people like [[Prostasia]]'s Meagan Ingerman.<ref>https://prostasia.org/blog/ageplay-is-for-adults/</ref> Professing a personal interest in "kink and ageplay", she constructs a highly convoluted "adults only" world of deviance for herself and other adults. On the basis of this subjective outlook, she then bars minors from seeking sexual pleasure of any kind - assuming the role of gatekeeper.

	The unsuitability of an over-complicated form of "adult sexuality" for "young minds" has been seen as a [[self-fulfilling prophecy]].		The unsuitability of an over-complicated form of "adult sexuality" for "young minds" has been seen as a [[self-fulfilling prophecy]].

The Admins at 23:45, 22 September 2021

2021-09-22T23:45:02Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:45, 22 September 2021
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	This argument is in effect the reverse of the [[Debate Guide: Liberty-empowerment\|liberty empowerment]] theory and is used to describe how paternalist/~~protectionist/parentalist/ageist~~ practises in society will sometimes ~~fulfil~~ their supporters' prophecies ~~that such measures will be required~~.		This argument is in effect the reverse of the [[Debate Guide: Liberty-empowerment\|liberty empowerment]] theory and is used to describe how paternalist/adultist practises in society will sometimes fulfill their supporters' prophecies - creating a demand for their own solutions.

	This argument (in relation to the concept of [[consent]]) is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li] on the MHAMic website:		This argument (in relation to the concept of [[consent]]) is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li] on the MHAMic website:
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	~~Some anti~~-drugs laws ~~that~~ aim to protect people from harmful substances have made the use of ~~virtually harmless substances potentially~~ deadly through poor ~~production standards and lack of appropriate~~ education~~. Similarly, attempting to protect~~ a ~~class of people from natural, human sexuality leads~~ to ~~inadequate education and hands control of these practises to a hidden, criminal element~~. ~~Therefore, protectionist actions may be excused by~~ the ~~unthinking because they allegedly~~ "~~prevent~~" and ~~"bring closure~~ to" the ~~problems~~ they are in ~~part responsible for causing~~.		Anti-drugs laws (for example), aim to protect people from harmful substances. However, they have made the use of natural drugs deadly through contamination and poor education surrounding the underlying mental imbalances that must exist for a person to become drug dependent. By simply viewing the drugs as "bad" (a la Mr. Mackey) and something to be avoided, without considering the mental imbalances that put them at risk of dependency, young people are more likely to turn to drugs when they are most depressed and vulnerable. A dependency relationship ensues in later youth or adulthood.

	To resolve ~~this~~ issue, young people ~~should~~ be ~~handed back control~~ of their ~~bodies~~ and ~~taught not~~ to ~~feel guilty about~~ their ~~sexuality~~.		To resolve the drug issue, young people must be given a full understanding of their minds, and time to explore their limits - including limited drug use (if sought) - only while in a secure mental state and environment. Similarly, an exploration body-pleasure should be encouraged at an early age, and this should be on the young person's terms, with no social guilt or stigma.

	==Adultism==		==Adultism==

The Admins: /* Adultism */

2021-09-22T23:27:15Z

Adultism

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:27, 22 September 2021
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	==Adultism==		==Adultism==

	It may be important to consider that the idea of "sexual maturity" is an ''adultist'' concept ~~that is~~ imposed on the worlds of minors. What constitutes sexual maturity is defined by the adults who have "attained" it, but critically, those with the power to determine what it is. This elitism can be seen among people like [[Prostasia]]'s Meagan Ingerman<ref>https://prostasia.org/blog/ageplay-is-for-adults/</ref>, who professes an interest in "kink and ageplay". She is a typical adultist kink snob/gatekeeper in that she constructs a highly convoluted "adults only" world of subjective deviance for herself, and then withholds virtually every other kind of shared sexual pleasure from minors.		It may be important to consider that the idea of "sexual maturity" is an ''adultist'' concept, imposed on the worlds of minors. What constitutes sexual maturity is defined by the adults who have "attained" it, but critically, those with the power to determine what it is. This elitism can be seen among people like [[Prostasia]]'s Meagan Ingerman<ref>https://prostasia.org/blog/ageplay-is-for-adults/</ref>, who professes an interest in "kink and ageplay". She is a typical adultist kink snob/gatekeeper in that she constructs a highly convoluted "adults only" world of subjective deviance for herself, and then withholds virtually every other kind of shared sexual pleasure from minors.

	The unsuitability of an over-complicated form of "adult sexuality" for "young minds" has been seen as a [[self-fulfilling prophecy]].		The unsuitability of an over-complicated form of "adult sexuality" for "young minds" has been seen as a [[self-fulfilling prophecy]].

The Admins: Integrate and improve

2021-09-21T20:08:48Z

Integrate and improve

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:08, 21 September 2021
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	This argument (in relation to the concept of [[consent]]) is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li] on the MHAMic website:		This argument (in relation to the concept of [[consent]]) is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li] on the MHAMic website:


	[[Image:Li.gif]]		[[Image:Li.gif]]


	Some anti-drugs laws that aim to protect people from harmful substances have made the use of virtually harmless substances potentially deadly through poor production standards and lack of appropriate education. Similarly, attempting to protect a class of people from natural, human sexuality leads to inadequate education and hands control of these practises to a hidden, criminal element. Therefore, protectionist actions may be excused by the unthinking because they allegedly "prevent" and "bring closure to" the problems they are in part responsible for causing.		Some anti-drugs laws that aim to protect people from harmful substances have made the use of virtually harmless substances potentially deadly through poor production standards and lack of appropriate education. Similarly, attempting to protect a class of people from natural, human sexuality leads to inadequate education and hands control of these practises to a hidden, criminal element. Therefore, protectionist actions may be excused by the unthinking because they allegedly "prevent" and "bring closure to" the problems they are in part responsible for causing.

	To resolve this issue, young people should be handed back control of their bodies and taught not to feel guilty about their sexuality.		To resolve this issue, young people should be handed back control of their bodies and taught not to feel guilty about their sexuality.

			==Adultism==

			It may be important to consider that the idea of "sexual maturity" is an ''adultist'' concept that is imposed on the worlds of minors. What constitutes sexual maturity is defined by the adults who have "attained" it, but critically, those with the power to determine what it is. This elitism can be seen among people like [[Prostasia]]'s Meagan Ingerman<ref>https://prostasia.org/blog/ageplay-is-for-adults/</ref>, who professes an interest in "kink and ageplay". She is a typical adultist kink snob/gatekeeper in that she constructs a highly convoluted "adults only" world of subjective deviance for herself, and then withholds virtually every other kind of shared sexual pleasure from minors.

			The unsuitability of an over-complicated form of "adult sexuality" for "young minds" has been seen as a [[self-fulfilling prophecy]].

			==See also==

			*[[Research: Sexual repression]]
			*[[Research: Youth sexuality]]
			*[[Research: Secondary Harm]]

			==References==

	[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]		[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]

	[[fr:Guide de débat: Paternalisme cyclique]]		[[fr:Guide de débat: Paternalisme cyclique]]

Boeotia at 19:10, 23 April 2009

2009-04-23T19:10:11Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:10, 23 April 2009
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	[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]		[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]

			[[fr:Guide de débat: Paternalisme cyclique]]

The Admins: improve

2009-03-21T21:41:42Z

improve

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:41, 21 March 2009
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	~~Basically~~ the reverse of [[Liberty ~~Empowerment~~]] theory~~, this~~ is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li] on the MHAMic website:		This argument is in effect the reverse of the [[Debate Guide: Liberty-empowerment\|liberty empowerment]] theory and is used to describe how paternalist/protectionist/parentalist/ageist practises in society will sometimes fulfil their supporters' prophecies that such measures will be required.

			This argument (in relation to the concept of [[consent]]) is summed up by [http://www.mhamic.org/sources/li1.htm Chin-Keung Li] on the MHAMic website:

	[[Image:Li.gif]]		[[Image:Li.gif]]

	~~Child protection creates~~ a ~~need for child protection~~, ~~just like self interested man 1's gun creates a need for self interested man 2's gun. Time has come for us~~ to ~~educate our young~~ and ~~give them the freedom~~ to ~~control at least~~ a ~~few more of their own affairs~~. ~~This is not only relevant to their enjoyment and freedom~~, ~~but their welfare~~ and ~~futures which as with most things~~ are ~~better off under the control of their beholders~~. ~~But to achieve~~ this, ~~we must make them able. This can~~ be ~~achieved via the promotion~~ of ~~ideas similar~~ to ~~those on this website~~.		Some anti-drugs laws that aim to protect people from harmful substances have made the use of virtually harmless substances potentially deadly through poor production standards and lack of appropriate education. Similarly, attempting to protect a class of people from natural, human sexuality leads to inadequate education and hands control of these practises to a hidden, criminal element. Therefore, protectionist actions may be excused by the unthinking because they allegedly "prevent" and "bring closure to" the problems they are in part responsible for causing.

			To resolve this issue, young people should be handed back control of their bodies and taught not to feel guilty about their sexuality.

	[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]		[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]

Rez: Debate Guide: Cyclical Paternalism moved to Debate Guide: Cyclical paternalism

2008-12-16T19:53:48Z

Debate Guide: Cyclical Paternalism moved to Debate Guide: Cyclical paternalism

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:53, 16 December 2008
(No difference)

Rez at 18:39, 8 October 2008

2008-10-08T18:39:53Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:39, 8 October 2008
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	Child protection creates a need for child protection, just like self interested man 1's gun creates a need for self interested man 2's gun. Time has come for us to educate our young and give them the freedom to control at least a few more of their own affairs. This is not only relevant to their enjoyment and freedom, but their welfare and futures which as with most things are better off under the control of their beholders. But to achieve this, we must make them able. This can be achieved via the promotion of ideas similar to those on this website.		Child protection creates a need for child protection, just like self interested man 1's gun creates a need for self interested man 2's gun. Time has come for us to educate our young and give them the freedom to control at least a few more of their own affairs. This is not only relevant to their enjoyment and freedom, but their welfare and futures which as with most things are better off under the control of their beholders. But to achieve this, we must make them able. This can be achieved via the promotion of ideas similar to those on this website.

			[[Category:Debate]][[Category:Debating Points: Child/Minor]]

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:50, 23 October 2021
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	==See also==		==See also==

			*[[Research: Cognitive ability]]
	*[[Research: Sexual repression]]		*[[Research: Sexual repression]]
	*[[Research: Youth sexuality]]		*[[Research: Youth sexuality]]