Essay:Michael Jackson: Secrets - Revision history

Rist10 at 00:26, 4 May 2024

2024-05-04T00:26:54Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:26, 4 May 2024
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	''A critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''		''A critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''

	22/04/23 ◆ '''~~Anonymous~~'''		22/04/23 ◆ '''Nocturne'''
	<hr>		<hr>
	[[File:James Safechuck and Michael Jackson.png\|thumb\|The love Michael and James once shared. Photoshoot from the 'Bad' era.]]		[[File:James Safechuck and Michael Jackson.png\|thumb\|The love Michael and James once shared. Photoshoot from the 'Bad' era.]]
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	==Notes==		==Notes==

	[[Category:Essays]][[Category:~~ZedloveX~~'s Essays]]		[[Category:Essays]][[Category:Nocturne's Essays]]

Rist10 at 00:24, 4 May 2024

2024-05-04T00:24:57Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:24, 4 May 2024
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	''A critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''		''A critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''

	22/04/23 ◆ '''~~ZedloveX~~'''		22/04/23 ◆ '''Anonymous'''
	<hr>		<hr>
	[[File:James Safechuck and Michael Jackson.png\|thumb\|The love Michael and James once shared. Photoshoot from the 'Bad' era.]]		[[File:James Safechuck and Michael Jackson.png\|thumb\|The love Michael and James once shared. Photoshoot from the 'Bad' era.]]

Rist10 at 05:37, 4 May 2023

2023-05-04T05:37:30Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:37, 4 May 2023
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	[[File:70b4c60f11e2aa368e2c97b1499448df.jpg\|thumb\|Look at MJ's hand on Jonathan's thigh. Does that look like a normal friendship?]]		[[File:70b4c60f11e2aa368e2c97b1499448df.jpg\|thumb\|Look at MJ's hand on Jonathan's thigh. Does that look like a normal friendship?]]
	'''Finally, to the MJ superfans out there: It's cruel to the people that have told their stories to deny that Michael Jackson was a boylover. It is also okay to still love him both a person and as an artist, despite his sexual orientation.''' He was obsessed with boyhood, slept with boys hundreds if not thousands of times,<ref>[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0ocOkcq-AM YouTube: Michael Jackson slept with Brett Barnes 450+ times!]</ref><ref>[http://www.mjfacts.com/transcripts/Court_Transcript_5_06_2005.pdf California vs Jackson Transcript]</ref> and was photographed being intimate with boys ''at the very least''. Anyone who thinks otherwise is simply creating a ridiculous narrative that he had to relive his childhood by hanging around and sleeping with, specifically, 7-14 year old angelic white and Latino boys. He was probably also reliving his childhood, but it was not asexual in motivation. A nude photo of [https://www.mjfacts.com/category/jonathan-spence/ Jonathan Spence], one of the boys he was ~~frequency~~ seen with in the early to mid 1980s, was discovered by the police in the 1993 police investigations.<ref>[https://www.mjfacts.com/resources/011805pltreqaseemd.pdf Plaintiff's Request to admit seized evidence]</ref> The evidence was inadmissible because Jonathan has denied that MJ had sex with him, despite the obvious signs that he did. Additionally, the image was not sexual in nature, so it was not illegal in and of itself. Even after Michael's death, Jonathan continues to defend his old friend and the love they shared.		'''Finally, to the MJ superfans out there: It's cruel to the people that have told their stories to deny that Michael Jackson was a boylover. It is also okay to still love him both a person and as an artist, despite his sexual orientation.''' He was obsessed with boyhood, slept with boys hundreds if not thousands of times,<ref>[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0ocOkcq-AM YouTube: Michael Jackson slept with Brett Barnes 450+ times!]</ref><ref>[http://www.mjfacts.com/transcripts/Court_Transcript_5_06_2005.pdf California vs Jackson Transcript]</ref> and was photographed being intimate with boys ''at the very least''. Anyone who thinks otherwise is simply creating a ridiculous narrative that he had to relive his childhood by hanging around and sleeping with, specifically, 7-14 year old angelic white and Latino boys. He was probably also reliving his childhood, but it was not asexual in motivation. A nude photo of [https://www.mjfacts.com/category/jonathan-spence/ Jonathan Spence], one of the boys he was frequently seen with in the early to mid 1980s, was discovered by the police in the 1993 police investigations.<ref>[https://www.mjfacts.com/resources/011805pltreqaseemd.pdf Plaintiff's Request to admit seized evidence]</ref> The evidence was inadmissible because Jonathan has denied that MJ had sex with him, despite the obvious signs that he did. Additionally, the image was not sexual in nature, so it was not illegal in and of itself. Even after Michael's death, Jonathan continues to defend his old friend and the love they shared.

	Regardless, the love Michael had with these boys was beautiful. It was nearly impossible for things to end well. Michael's life and career was effectively ruined by being a boy lover, and the men feel genuine trauma today from these secrets they kept. '''Their feelings are real and valid, and we should not blame them for the actions they are taking now.''' I hope one day, the story doesn't have to end like how it did. We can do better, as a society. End the secrets. Legalize love.		Regardless, the love Michael had with these boys was beautiful. It was nearly impossible for things to end well. Michael's life and career was effectively ruined by being a boy lover, and the men feel genuine trauma today from these secrets they kept. '''Their feelings are real and valid, and we should not blame them for the actions they are taking now.''' I hope one day, the story doesn't have to end like how it did. We can do better, as a society. End the secrets. Legalize love.

Rist10 at 06:16, 25 April 2023

2023-04-25T06:16:35Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:16, 25 April 2023
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	In addition, I'm also in the same position as James and Wade, albeit on a much smaller scale. As I mentioned, I also has a positive sexual experience with an adult as a young boy. But this is a secret I will have to take to my grave, at least outside of anonymous circles. Something that is so foundational in my life can never be mentioned in therapy, for example, as it would trigger a mandatory reporting process that I have no desire to go through. Thus, I remain trapped in secrets perpetually.		In addition, I'm also in the same position as James and Wade, albeit on a much smaller scale. As I mentioned, I also has a positive sexual experience with an adult as a young boy. But this is a secret I will have to take to my grave, at least outside of anonymous circles. Something that is so foundational in my life can never be mentioned in therapy, for example, as it would trigger a mandatory reporting process that I have no desire to go through. Thus, I remain trapped in secrets perpetually.

	Ultimately, Michael Jackson was a complex person. For one, he was likely ~~trans-age~~. He spoke on his desire to never grow up, and [https://youtu.be/QkbNdCRUXl8?t=960 much of his plastic surgery was seemingly modeled after Peter Pan]. Beyond this, his humanitarian efforts involving impoverished children totals in the hundreds of millions,<ref>[https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-jul-08-et-cause8-story.html LA Times: Giving in spirit and deed]</ref><ref>[https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/michael-jackson Look To The Stars: Michael Jackson Charity Work, Events and Causes]</ref> and he is ranked in Guinness as one of the most prolific humanitarians.<ref>[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/michael-jackson-charity-work-honored-by-guinness-world-records/ MichaelJackson.com: Michael Jackson Charity Work Honored By Guinness World Records]</ref> He effectively defined what it means to be a humanitarian as a performer. It's hard to argue that the harm Michael directly caused outweighed his other incredible contributions, from a consequentialist standpoint.		Ultimately, Michael Jackson was a complex person. For one, he was likely [[Transage\|transage]]. He spoke on his desire to never grow up, and [https://youtu.be/QkbNdCRUXl8?t=960 much of his plastic surgery was seemingly modeled after Peter Pan]. Beyond this, his humanitarian efforts involving impoverished children totals in the hundreds of millions,<ref>[https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-jul-08-et-cause8-story.html LA Times: Giving in spirit and deed]</ref><ref>[https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/michael-jackson Look To The Stars: Michael Jackson Charity Work, Events and Causes]</ref> and he is ranked in Guinness as one of the most prolific humanitarians.<ref>[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/michael-jackson-charity-work-honored-by-guinness-world-records/ MichaelJackson.com: Michael Jackson Charity Work Honored By Guinness World Records]</ref> He effectively defined what it means to be a humanitarian as a performer. It's hard to argue that the harm Michael directly caused outweighed his other incredible contributions, from a consequentialist standpoint.

	That being said... This movie has further cemented my view that child-adult sexual relationships are ''very unlikely'' to have positive outcomes in 2023. For me, pro-C means waiting until the societal barriers to positive outcomes have been lifted, and prioritizing the happiness of children. There is simply too much pressure to conform to how you're supposed to feel as a victim, for one, and the need for constant unrelenting secrecy to protect your former lover. In fact, regardless of how consensual these interactions were with regards to enthusiastic consent (saying yes and liking it), there was a clear lack of informed consent. These boys most certainly did not know how society would view the acts they were undertaking. Michael was a practically godlike figure in the 1980s. '''It was not fair that Michael Jackson, one of the most powerful people in the world, forced the two middle class boys carry such a heavy burden in a society that was not even accepting of gay people yet.''' After watching Leaving Neverland, I feel sorry for everyone involved. It's sad all around.		That being said... This movie has further cemented my view that child-adult sexual relationships are ''very unlikely'' to have positive outcomes in 2023. For me, pro-C means waiting until the societal barriers to positive outcomes have been lifted, and prioritizing the happiness of children. There is simply too much pressure to conform to how you're supposed to feel as a victim, for one, and the need for constant unrelenting secrecy to protect your former lover. In fact, regardless of how consensual these interactions were with regards to enthusiastic consent (saying yes and liking it), there was a clear lack of informed consent. These boys most certainly did not know how society would view the acts they were undertaking. Michael was a practically godlike figure in the 1980s. '''It was not fair that Michael Jackson, one of the most powerful people in the world, forced the two middle class boys carry such a heavy burden in a society that was not even accepting of gay people yet.''' After watching Leaving Neverland, I feel sorry for everyone involved. It's sad all around.

Rist10 at 06:06, 25 April 2023

2023-04-25T06:06:20Z

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 Well, to answer the question, after watching Leaving Neverland yesterday, I’ve been a nervous wreck for the past 24 hours. The movie brought up past anxieties in ways I didn’t expect, especially relating to how secrets eat us alive. Looking at the "Man in the Mirror" in the film, I see myself staring back in many ways.
-There is a lot of detail in the documentary, and I won't discuss everything. However, I will cover the important aspects. First of all, both Wade and James enjoyed the sex they had with Michael. They reiterated that he was gentle, and they never felt it was odd or unusual. At one point in the documentary, James Safechuck discusses how Michael bought wedding rings for the pair to become married to each other. It really felt like there was true, radiating love in both instances. In 'The way you make me feel', written around the time of his relationship with James, Michael sang "Ain't nobody's business but mine and my baby". For years, this was the case for the two boys' relationships with Michael. At least until 2013, when they both filed lawsuits against MJ's company, alleging they were not properly protected from sexual abuse.
+There is a lot of detail in the documentary, and I won't discuss everything. However, I will cover the important aspects. First of all, both Wade and James enjoyed the sex they had with Michael. They reiterated that he was gentle, and they never felt it was odd or unusual. At one point in the documentary, James Safechuck discusses how Michael bought wedding rings for the pair to become married to each other. It really felt like there was true, radiating love in both instances. Here are some excerpts:
 '''So, where did things go wrong for James and Wade? I believe there are a several key points:'''

Rist10 at 01:13, 25 April 2023

2023-04-25T01:13:56Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:13, 25 April 2023
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	Ultimately, Michael Jackson was a complex person. For one, he was likely trans-age. He spoke on his desire to never grow up, and [https://youtu.be/QkbNdCRUXl8?t=960 much of his plastic surgery was seemingly modeled after Peter Pan]. Beyond this, his humanitarian efforts involving impoverished children totals in the hundreds of millions,<ref>[https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-jul-08-et-cause8-story.html LA Times: Giving in spirit and deed]</ref><ref>[https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/michael-jackson Look To The Stars: Michael Jackson Charity Work, Events and Causes]</ref> and he is ranked in Guinness as one of the most prolific humanitarians.<ref>[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/michael-jackson-charity-work-honored-by-guinness-world-records/ MichaelJackson.com: Michael Jackson Charity Work Honored By Guinness World Records]</ref> He effectively defined what it means to be a humanitarian as a performer. It's hard to argue that the harm Michael directly caused outweighed his other incredible contributions, from a consequentialist standpoint.		Ultimately, Michael Jackson was a complex person. For one, he was likely trans-age. He spoke on his desire to never grow up, and [https://youtu.be/QkbNdCRUXl8?t=960 much of his plastic surgery was seemingly modeled after Peter Pan]. Beyond this, his humanitarian efforts involving impoverished children totals in the hundreds of millions,<ref>[https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-jul-08-et-cause8-story.html LA Times: Giving in spirit and deed]</ref><ref>[https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/michael-jackson Look To The Stars: Michael Jackson Charity Work, Events and Causes]</ref> and he is ranked in Guinness as one of the most prolific humanitarians.<ref>[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/michael-jackson-charity-work-honored-by-guinness-world-records/ MichaelJackson.com: Michael Jackson Charity Work Honored By Guinness World Records]</ref> He effectively defined what it means to be a humanitarian as a performer. It's hard to argue that the harm Michael directly caused outweighed his other incredible contributions, from a consequentialist standpoint.

	That being said... This movie has further cemented my view that child-adult sexual relationships are ''very unlikely'' to have positive outcomes in 2023. For me, pro-C means waiting until the societal barriers to positive outcomes have been lifted, and prioritizing the happiness of children. There is simply too much pressure to conform to how you're supposed to feel as a victim, for one, and the need for constant unrelenting secrecy to protect your former lover. Michael was a practically godlike figure in the 1980s. '''It was not fair that Michael Jackson, one of the most powerful people in the world, forced the two middle class boys carry such a heavy burden in a society that was not even accepting of gay people yet.''' After watching Leaving Neverland, I feel sorry for everyone involved. It's sad all around.		That being said... This movie has further cemented my view that child-adult sexual relationships are ''very unlikely'' to have positive outcomes in 2023. For me, pro-C means waiting until the societal barriers to positive outcomes have been lifted, and prioritizing the happiness of children. There is simply too much pressure to conform to how you're supposed to feel as a victim, for one, and the need for constant unrelenting secrecy to protect your former lover. In fact, regardless of how consensual these interactions were with regards to enthusiastic consent (saying yes and liking it), there was a clear lack of informed consent. These boys most certainly did not know how society would view the acts they were undertaking. Michael was a practically godlike figure in the 1980s. '''It was not fair that Michael Jackson, one of the most powerful people in the world, forced the two middle class boys carry such a heavy burden in a society that was not even accepting of gay people yet.''' After watching Leaving Neverland, I feel sorry for everyone involved. It's sad all around.

	Michael was a victim of society, and also his fame in his early childhood. His two boyfriends were also victims of society. Their consensual relationships were forced into secrecy, and they were compelled to testify twice to save their friend. They were also subjected to bad behavior directly by Michael, like dropping them for new boys. These actions do not make him a monster: He is simply a flawed human, as we all are in other ways.		Michael was a victim of society, and also his fame in his early childhood. His two boyfriends were also victims of society. Their consensual relationships were forced into secrecy, and they were compelled to testify twice to save their friend. They were also subjected to bad behavior directly by Michael, like dropping them for new boys. These actions do not make him a monster: He is simply a flawed human, as we all are in other ways.

Rist10 at 20:05, 22 April 2023

2023-04-22T20:05:02Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:05, 22 April 2023
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	In addition, I'm also in the same position as James and Wade, albeit on a much smaller scale. As I mentioned, I also has a positive sexual experience with an adult as a young boy. But this is a secret I will have to take to my grave, at least outside of anonymous circles. Something that is so foundational in my life can never be mentioned in therapy, for example, as it would trigger a mandatory reporting process that I have no desire to go through. Thus, I remain trapped in secrets perpetually.		In addition, I'm also in the same position as James and Wade, albeit on a much smaller scale. As I mentioned, I also has a positive sexual experience with an adult as a young boy. But this is a secret I will have to take to my grave, at least outside of anonymous circles. Something that is so foundational in my life can never be mentioned in therapy, for example, as it would trigger a mandatory reporting process that I have no desire to go through. Thus, I remain trapped in secrets perpetually.

	Ultimately, Michael Jackson was a complex person. For one, he was likely trans-age. He spoke on his desire to never grow up, and [https://youtu.be/QkbNdCRUXl8?t=960 much of his plastic surgery was seemingly modeled after Peter Pan]. Beyond this, his humanitarian efforts involving impoverished children totals in the hundreds of millions,<ref>[https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-jul-08-et-cause8-story.html LA Times: Giving in spirit and deed]</ref><ref>[https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/michael-jackson Look To The Stars: Michael Jackson Charity Work, Events and Causes]</ref> and he is ranked in Guinness as one of the most prolific humanitarians.<ref>[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/michael-jackson-charity-work-honored-by-guinness-world-records/ MichaelJackson.com: Michael Jackson Charity Work Honored By Guinness World Records]</ref> He effectively defined what it means to be a humanitarian as a performer. It's hard to argue that the harm Michael ~~indirectly~~ caused outweighed his other incredible contributions, from a consequentialist standpoint.		Ultimately, Michael Jackson was a complex person. For one, he was likely trans-age. He spoke on his desire to never grow up, and [https://youtu.be/QkbNdCRUXl8?t=960 much of his plastic surgery was seemingly modeled after Peter Pan]. Beyond this, his humanitarian efforts involving impoverished children totals in the hundreds of millions,<ref>[https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-jul-08-et-cause8-story.html LA Times: Giving in spirit and deed]</ref><ref>[https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/michael-jackson Look To The Stars: Michael Jackson Charity Work, Events and Causes]</ref> and he is ranked in Guinness as one of the most prolific humanitarians.<ref>[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/michael-jackson-charity-work-honored-by-guinness-world-records/ MichaelJackson.com: Michael Jackson Charity Work Honored By Guinness World Records]</ref> He effectively defined what it means to be a humanitarian as a performer. It's hard to argue that the harm Michael directly caused outweighed his other incredible contributions, from a consequentialist standpoint.

	That being said... This movie has further cemented my view that child-adult sexual relationships are ''very unlikely'' to have positive outcomes in 2023. For me, pro-C means waiting until the societal barriers to positive outcomes have been lifted, and prioritizing the happiness of children. There is simply too much pressure to conform to how you're supposed to feel as a victim, for one, and the need for constant unrelenting secrecy to protect your former lover. Michael was a practically godlike figure in the 1980s. '''It was not fair that Michael Jackson, one of the most powerful people in the world, forced the two middle class boys carry such a heavy burden in a society that was not even accepting of gay people yet.''' After watching Leaving Neverland, I feel sorry for everyone involved. It's sad all around.		That being said... This movie has further cemented my view that child-adult sexual relationships are ''very unlikely'' to have positive outcomes in 2023. For me, pro-C means waiting until the societal barriers to positive outcomes have been lifted, and prioritizing the happiness of children. There is simply too much pressure to conform to how you're supposed to feel as a victim, for one, and the need for constant unrelenting secrecy to protect your former lover. Michael was a practically godlike figure in the 1980s. '''It was not fair that Michael Jackson, one of the most powerful people in the world, forced the two middle class boys carry such a heavy burden in a society that was not even accepting of gay people yet.''' After watching Leaving Neverland, I feel sorry for everyone involved. It's sad all around.

Rist10 at 20:03, 22 April 2023

2023-04-22T20:03:34Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:03, 22 April 2023
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	'''Michael Jackson: Secrets'''		'''Michael Jackson: Secrets'''

	''~~An objective~~ critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''		''A critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''

	22/04/23 ◆ '''ZedloveX'''		22/04/23 ◆ '''ZedloveX'''

Rist10 at 20:03, 22 April 2023

2023-04-22T20:03:02Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:03, 22 April 2023
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	'''Michael Jackson: Secrets'''		'''Michael Jackson: Secrets'''

	''An objective critique of Michael Jackson's boy love''		''An objective critique of Michael Jackson's boy love, and how things can be different.''

	22/04/23 ◆ '''ZedloveX'''		22/04/23 ◆ '''ZedloveX'''

Rist10 at 20:02, 22 April 2023

2023-04-22T20:02:32Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:02, 22 April 2023
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	'''Michael Jackson: Secrets'''		'''Michael Jackson: Secrets'''

	''An objective critique of Michael Jackson's boy love''		''An objective critique of Michael Jackson's boy love''

	22/04/23 ◆ '''ZedloveX'''		22/04/23 ◆ '''ZedloveX'''
	<hr>		<hr>