Testimony: Adult Male with Minor Male - Revision history

Prue at 18:17, 26 August 2026

2026-08-26T18:17:12Z

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	*'''Keith Vacha, ''Quiet Fire: Memoirs of Older Gay Men'', edited by Cassie Damewood (Trumansburg, New York: The Crossing Press, 1985).'''		*'''Keith Vacha, ''Quiet Fire: Memoirs of Older Gay Men'', edited by Cassie Damewood (Trumansburg, New York: The Crossing Press, 1985).'''
	*:[Ed] From 1978-1984, gay writer Keith Vacha conducted interviews with gay-identifying men, mostly in California and Arizona, who were at least 55 years old. Taken from over 100 taped interviews of 2-10 hours, ''Quiet Fire'' presents 17 stories of gay men from the pre-[[Historical_examples_of_LGBT-MAP_unity\|stonewall]] generation. In his summary, Vacha claims to have mixed real names and pseudonyms, and notes "a high degree of inter-generational relationships among the men I met" (p. 217). Of particular interest to this article is '''Bob Basker''' (Born September 30, 1918 in East Harlem, New York City. Died April 6, 2001) - Interviewed by Keith Vacha at age 65. The youngest of 5 sons, Basker participated in early black civil rights/desegregation and homophile activism. Basker hired a black man and refused to fire him after his superior insisted black workers went against company policy, costing him his job. With his then wife Greta, Basker "became the nominee purchasers to obtain a home for a black couple in Skokie (Illinois), Bob and Mary Smythe" (p. 54). He explains: "All hell broke loose. Our house was firebombed, we had unending obscene phone calls and death threats, and all our bank loans were cancelled" (Ibid). Basker turned to gay issues, and in 1965 became founding president of "Mattachine Midwest," the first Mattachine Society in Chicago. He also "helped to start the [Miami] Gay Activist Alliance in 1971" (p. 55) and became the Executive Director of Florida's Dade County Coalition for the Humanistic Rights of Gays (p. 56). He said the following about his young sex-life:		*:[Ed] From 1978-1984, gay writer Keith Vacha conducted interviews with gay-identifying men, mostly in California and Arizona, who were at least 55 years old. Taken from over 100 taped interviews of 2-10 hours, ''Quiet Fire'' presents 17 stories of gay men from the pre-[[Historical_examples_of_LGBT-MAP_unity\|stonewall]] generation. In his summary, Vacha claims to have mixed real names and pseudonyms, and notes "a high degree of inter-generational relationships among the men I met" (p. 217).

			::Of particular interest to this article is '''Bob Basker''' (Born September 30, 1918 in East Harlem, New York City. Died April 6, 2001) - Interviewed by Keith Vacha at age 65. The youngest of 5 sons, Basker participated in early black civil rights/desegregation and homophile activism. Basker hired a black man and refused to fire him after his superior insisted black workers went against company policy, costing him his job. With his then wife Greta, Basker "became the nominee purchasers to obtain a home for a black couple in Skokie (Illinois), Bob and Mary Smythe" (p. 54). He explains: "All hell broke loose. Our house was firebombed, we had unending obscene phone calls and death threats, and all our bank loans were cancelled" (Ibid). Basker turned to gay issues, and in 1965 became founding president of "Mattachine Midwest," the first Mattachine Society in Chicago. He also "helped to start the [Miami] Gay Activist Alliance in 1971" (p. 55) and became the Executive Director of Florida's Dade County Coalition for the Humanistic Rights of Gays (p. 56). He said the following about his young sex-life:

	::"When I began selling newspapers at night, between the ages of eleven and fifteen, I was exposed to a lot of sex in [subway station] tearooms. [...] You'd meet people having sex with each other, not always, but often all through the night. Sometimes you'd walk in and they were in the midst of having some kind of sex and they'd look up and say, "Oh, it's only a kid," and go right back to whatever they were doing. I was serviced regularly and once in a while I would do the servicing. I met some really nice people who were afraid of being involved with a thirteen, fourteen, fifteen-year-old kid but I did manage to go home with some of them. I was generally the aggressor" (p. 46).		::"When I began selling newspapers at night, between the ages of eleven and fifteen, I was exposed to a lot of sex in [subway station] tearooms. [...] You'd meet people having sex with each other, not always, but often all through the night. Sometimes you'd walk in and they were in the midst of having some kind of sex and they'd look up and say, "Oh, it's only a kid," and go right back to whatever they were doing. I was serviced regularly and once in a while I would do the servicing. I met some really nice people who were afraid of being involved with a thirteen, fourteen, fifteen-year-old kid but I did manage to go home with some of them. I was generally the aggressor" (p. 46).

Prue at 18:16, 26 August 2026

2026-08-26T18:16:27Z

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	*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"		*The late '''Scotty Bowers''', famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret.
			::"I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"

	*'''[https://news.yahoo.com/george-takei-pedophilia-tape-posted-195359153.html George Takei]''' at age 13 or 14 (accounts vary) with a 19 year old.		*'''[https://news.yahoo.com/george-takei-pedophilia-tape-posted-195359153.html George Takei]''' at age 13 or 14 (accounts vary) with a 19 year old.

Prue at 18:14, 26 August 2026

2026-08-26T18:14:36Z

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	*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].
	*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
	*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''
	*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski of CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.
	*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.
	*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"		*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"

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	*:"Researcher: You mentioned that you always had an interest in adult men?		*:"Researcher: You mentioned that you always had an interest in adult men?
	*:"Philip: Yeah! I would say that from the age of seven onwards that my focus on sex and men have always been more mature men.... In all the relationships and friendships I was involved in, I knew exactly what I was doing, and knew what I set out to do and was fully in control. And there were times as a boy, I travelled to and from school by train . . . and you would occasionally get old men into the apartment. ... Sometimes I’d get turned on by that and hope that something happened and I’d engineer a situation. I’d play with my crotch or something to see if they were watching out the corner of their eye but if ever a man made an approach on me that would terrify me. ... I had to at all times be the seducer and initiator, and I think that was right and proper because I was a child and I knew my circumstances, I knew I was smaller and they were bigger and stronger men and I knew what rape was, and knew what physical assault was, and I wasn’t going to let that happen to me. ... It never happened to me!"		*:"Philip: Yeah! I would say that from the age of seven onwards that my focus on sex and men have always been more mature men.... In all the relationships and friendships I was involved in, I knew exactly what I was doing, and knew what I set out to do and was fully in control. And there were times as a boy, I travelled to and from school by train . . . and you would occasionally get old men into the apartment. ... Sometimes I’d get turned on by that and hope that something happened and I’d engineer a situation. I’d play with my crotch or something to see if they were watching out the corner of their eye but if ever a man made an approach on me that would terrify me. ... I had to at all times be the seducer and initiator, and I think that was right and proper because I was a child and I knew my circumstances, I knew I was smaller and they were bigger and stronger men and I knew what rape was, and knew what physical assault was, and I wasn’t going to let that happen to me. ... It never happened to me!"


			*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].
			*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
			*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''
			*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski of CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.
			*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.

	*'''[http://web.archive.org/web/20040823204921/http://www.logicalreality.com/openbb/read.php?TID=164 Pluto], on the Logical Reality forum.'''		*'''[http://web.archive.org/web/20040823204921/http://www.logicalreality.com/openbb/read.php?TID=164 Pluto], on the Logical Reality forum.'''

Jim Burton: I think this is a continuation of vacha

2025-12-15T19:38:53Z

I think this is a continuation of vacha

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:38, 15 December 2025
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	::"I had sex with different people three to four times a week, starting at the age of fourteen. [...] [T]hree times a week, fifty weeks a year, that's at least a hundred and fifty partners. Over a period of twenty years, three thousand partners. That creates a tremendous amount of sophisticated sex" (p. 48).		::"I had sex with different people three to four times a week, starting at the age of fourteen. [...] [T]hree times a week, fifty weeks a year, that's at least a hundred and fifty partners. Over a period of twenty years, three thousand partners. That creates a tremendous amount of sophisticated sex" (p. 48).

	*'''Al Hoskins''' - Small business owner in Berkeley, California, interviewed in his 60s.		::'''Al Hoskins''' - Small business owner in Berkeley, California, was interviewed in his 60s:

	::"When I was eleven I went over to the bus depot to the men's room. So many men [...] There was a guy there at the other end of the place who was sort of masturbating. I immediately got an erection which prompted him to walk over to me and start feeling me. Well, that of course thrilled me to no end. [...] My mother thought he was the nicest person. I used to visit him every time I went to the old Hippodrome Theatre." (p. 145).		::"When I was eleven I went over to the bus depot to the men's room. So many men [...] There was a guy there at the other end of the place who was sort of masturbating. I immediately got an erection which prompted him to walk over to me and start feeling me. Well, that of course thrilled me to no end. [...] My mother thought he was the nicest person. I used to visit him every time I went to the old Hippodrome Theatre." (p. 145).

Jim Burton at 01:04, 9 December 2025

2025-12-09T01:04:15Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:04, 9 December 2025
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	*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.		*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
	*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''		*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''
	*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski f CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.		*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski of CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.
	*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.		*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.
	*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"		*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"

Jim Burton at 01:03, 9 December 2025

2025-12-09T01:03:53Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:03, 9 December 2025
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	*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].		*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].
			*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
	*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''		*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''
	*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski f CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.		*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski f CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.
	*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
	*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.		*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.
	*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"		*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"

Jim Burton at 01:03, 9 December 2025

2025-12-09T01:03:20Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:03, 9 December 2025
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	*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].		*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].

			*'''[https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/01/29/the-passion-of-paul-shanley/ The Passion of Paul Shanley], 2005.'''
			*:Summary: A famous priest is accused of multiple sexual relations with adolescent boys and men. JoAnn Wypijewski f CounterPunch explains the nuance behind what media are presenting as a simple case of sexual predation.
	*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.		*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
	*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.		*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.

The Admins at 01:39, 10 January 2025

2025-01-10T01:39:53Z

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	*'''[[Rachel Hope Cleves]], [http://library.lol/main/4FB01D8582CB462BF79D0CF28A43BF00 Unspeakable: A Life Beyond Sexual Morality] (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2020).'''		*'''[[Rachel Hope Cleves]], [http://library.lol/main/4FB01D8582CB462BF79D0CF28A43BF00 Unspeakable: A Life Beyond Sexual Morality] (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2020).'''
	Eric Wolton - London sex worker picked up by once-famous gay/pederast (pan-sexual) author [[Norman Douglas]] at the age of 12, whose parents granted permission for him to travel with Douglas for a walking tour of Italy. With Wolton recalling the experience positively, Cleves writes~~: “A decade after they first met, [...] Wolton refused to disavow his childhood sexual relationship with Douglas, writing~~:		::Eric Wolton - London sex worker picked up by once-famous gay/pederast (pan-sexual) author [[Norman Douglas]] at the age of 12, whose parents granted permission for him to travel with Douglas for a walking tour of Italy. With Wolton recalling the experience positively, Cleves writes:

	<blockquote>''They were happy times [...] I have no evil thoughts about them although I am different today than I was then. You were my tin god and even now you are. I do really love you [...] I want you to understand Doug that you are more to me than ever you were. The difference is now that I am old enough to realise it.''</blockquote>		<blockquote>
			A decade after they first met, [...] Wolton refused to disavow his childhood sexual relationship with Douglas, writing:
	As an adult, Wolton pursued sexual encounters with women. He was ‘different’ than he had been as a boy, but he felt positively about his youthful sexual encounters with Douglas ~~nonetheless” (p~~. ~~54)~~. ~~Cleves indicates that “neither~~ the letters nor the actions of Douglas’s long-term child sexual partners indicate that they regarded their relationships with him through the framework of trauma" (~~''Ibid''~~).		<blockquote>
			''They were happy times [...] I have no evil thoughts about them although I am different today than I was then. You were my tin god and even now you are. I do really love you [...] I want you to understand Doug that you are more to me than ever you were. The difference is now that I am old enough to realise it.''
			</blockquote>
			As an adult, Wolton pursued sexual encounters with women. He was ‘different’ than he had been as a boy, but he felt positively about his youthful sexual encounters with Douglas nonetheless [...] neither the letters nor the actions of Douglas’s long-term child sexual partners indicate that they regarded their relationships with him through the framework of trauma (p. 54)
			</blockquote>

	*'''[http://www.newgon.net/CPP/HFP-072.htm Letter from John] in HFP Mailbag and [http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/13023005/ Sexual Abuse from a Victim] by John Tate, December 7, 2004.'''		*'''[http://www.newgon.net/CPP/HFP-072.htm Letter from John] in HFP Mailbag and [http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/13023005/ Sexual Abuse from a Victim] by John Tate, December 7, 2004.'''

The Admins at 00:29, 10 January 2025

2025-01-10T00:29:15Z

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			*'''Ian Bernard''', [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnSixDLrGlw Free Talk Live], 2010 [https://fstube.net/w/vESCJvnnpGe4jqRMX2gtEH backup].
			*:Summary: Radio show host pursued relations as an 11 year old boy, and refuses to back down. Co-host says he is unusually well-adjusted and doesn't need to see a psychiatrist, as callers express their disbelief.
	*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.		*'''[https://fstube.net/w/6ij9noaketMafmBdsGVHqg Scotty Bowers - Excerpts from the 2018 movie] by Matt Tyrnauer, "Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood"'''.
	*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"		*:The late Scotty Bowers, famously known "Hollywood's Pimp", was in fact a highly complex individual - having experienced real suffering as a serviceman. He also had a considerable influence on the sexual revolution after he returned, and was a key contact of [[Alfred Kinsey]]. His sexual experiences as a hustler in his youth, however, he does not regret. "I had a very nice childhood; a good childhood. The neighbour, who had two kids - his wife was a sweetheart and he was too, I couldn't think of anything but nice things to say about them [...] just because he wanted to cuddle me/hold me/jack me [off], I don't see anything wrong with that [...] abused? absolutely not; this is bullshit, man! There's no such thing as someone ruining your life when they suck your cock [...] even as a little kid, I saw nothing wrong with that [...] we were unloading the trailer and [the priest], I could tell by the look in his eye that he wanted me [...] then he proceeded to fix me up with friends, and through him, I would meet other priests and go to their church. Within weeks, I had seen approximately 25-30 priests. They paid me off in change out of the collection box (laughter) [...] everybody knew me downtown [as he describes his side hustles] I was doing my little thing all by myself. [...] I did what I did because I knew what I was doing and I wanted to do it"

Prue at 22:22, 21 May 2024

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	::"When I was eleven I went over to the bus depot to the men's room. So many men [...] There was a guy there at the other end of the place who was sort of masturbating. I immediately got an erection which prompted him to walk over to me and start feeling me. Well, that of course thrilled me to no end. [...] My mother thought he was the nicest person. I used to visit him every time I went to the old Hippodrome Theatre." (p. 145).		::"When I was eleven I went over to the bus depot to the men's room. So many men [...] There was a guy there at the other end of the place who was sort of masturbating. I immediately got an erection which prompted him to walk over to me and start feeling me. Well, that of course thrilled me to no end. [...] My mother thought he was the nicest person. I used to visit him every time I went to the old Hippodrome Theatre." (p. 145).

	* '''Jonathan Dollimore''' (born 1948) - Relationship from ages 14-15 with Tony, an adult family friend who was having sex with both him and his mother around the same time. British academic who pioneered [https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/view/document/obo-9780190221911/obo-9780190221911-0091.xml cultural materialism] as a practice for intepreting texts. Co-founder of the ''Centre for the Study of Sexual Dissidence'' at the University of Sussex, Dollimore's work has been claimed to be of "preeminent importance to English studies for the last forty years" and to have "revolutionized literary studies by combining a dedication to close textual analysis with an examination of the social and political contexts within which texts are produced and received" (Marlow, [https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/view/document/obo-9780190221911/obo-9780190221911-0089.xml 2020]). Influential for critical gender studies and later queer theory, his writing featured in ''The Lesbian and Gay Studies Reader'' ([https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/The_Lesbian_and_Gay_Studies_Reader.html?id=OmLrFXy3UoQC&redir_esc=y 1993]) alongside Gayle Rubin, David Halperin, and other pioneering queer academics who have discussed intergenerational sexuality.		* '''Jonathan Dollimore''' (born 1948) - Relationship from ages 14-15 with Tony, an adult family friend who was having sex with both him and his mother around the same time. British academic who pioneered [https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/view/document/obo-9780190221911/obo-9780190221911-0091.xml cultural materialism] as a practice for intepreting texts. Co-founder of the ''Centre for the Study of Sexual Dissidence'' at the University of Sussex, Dollimore's work has been claimed to be of "preeminent importance to English studies for the last forty years" and to have "revolutionized literary studies by combining a dedication to close textual analysis with an examination of the social and political contexts within which texts are produced and received" (Marlow, [https://www.oxfordbibliographies.com/view/document/obo-9780190221911/obo-9780190221911-0089.xml 2020]). Influential for critical gender studies and later queer theory, his writing featured in ''The Lesbian and Gay Studies Reader'' ([https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/The_Lesbian_and_Gay_Studies_Reader.html?id=OmLrFXy3UoQC&redir_esc=y 1993]) alongside [[Gayle Rubin]], David Halperin, and other pioneering queer academics who have discussed intergenerational sexuality.

	::''[http://library.lol/main/2165BB190230E4500117E36A873F72E2 '''Desire: A Memoir''']'' '''(1st edition, 2017: Bloomsbury Academic Press), pp. 1-5.'''		::''[http://library.lol/main/2165BB190230E4500117E36A873F72E2 '''Desire: A Memoir''']'' '''(1st edition, 2017: Bloomsbury Academic Press), pp. 1-5.'''

	::~~“Tony~~ was an interesting man, ex-RAF, nomadic, far more knowledgeable than any other adult I’d encountered, including all of my school teachers, and also seemingly genuinely interested in teaching me things – as well as having sex with me. It was under his influence that I started to read thoughtfully for the first time. He introduced me to writers like Kipling, Somerset Maugham, Graham Greene, Thomas Hardy and T. S. Eliot.		::"Tony was an interesting man, ex-RAF, nomadic, far more knowledgeable than any other adult I’d encountered, including all of my school teachers, and also seemingly genuinely interested in teaching me things – as well as having sex with me. It was under his influence that I started to read thoughtfully for the first time. He introduced me to writers like Kipling, Somerset Maugham, Graham Greene, Thomas Hardy and T. S. Eliot.

	::The cultural influence that Tony exerted on me would now be construed as ‘grooming’; and maybe it was, but it was also what made me want to learn to write. I did experience it as a desire, perhaps because it was so closely related to my sexual encounters with him, which weren’t demanding or complicated, and mainly consisted in him sympathetically helping me to orgasm. I liked that well enough to sometimes lie awake at night when he was staying with us, hoping he might come to my room to do it again.”		::The cultural influence that Tony exerted on me would now be construed as ‘grooming’; and maybe it was, but it was also what made me want to learn to write. I did experience it as a desire, perhaps because it was so closely related to my sexual encounters with him, which weren’t demanding or complicated, and mainly consisted in him sympathetically helping me to orgasm. I liked that well enough to sometimes lie awake at night when he was staying with us, hoping he might come to my room to do it again."

	::~~“I didn’t~~ feel personally betrayed by ~~Tony’s~~ attempted seduction of my mother; nor have I ever felt damaged by the sex he and I had together. Of course, I realized that, at the very least, he was betraying my ~~parents’s~~ trust in having sex with me, but, at the same time, that, too, was attractive to this adolescent.” (pp. 1-2, 2017, 1st edn).		::"I didn't feel personally betrayed by Tony's attempted seduction of my mother; nor have I ever felt damaged by the sex he and I had together. Of course, I realized that, at the very least, he was betraying my parent's trust in having sex with me, but, at the same time, that, too, was attractive to this adolescent." (pp. 1-2, 2017, 1st edn).

	::[Newgon: The 2nd edition to this book ([https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/Desire/b7EjEAAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=0 2021]) was endorsed by [[Edmund White]], who ~~spoke~~ positively of his own ~~intergen experience, as outlined in Bruce Rind’s 2013 Appendix to his chapter in ''Censoring Sex Research'' ([https://archive.org/details/censoringsexresearch/mode/2up 2013])~~. In this edition, Dollimore thinks back to his earliest sensual/sexual experience at "3 or 4 years old," concluding:		::[Newgon: The 2nd edition to this book ([https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/Desire/b7EjEAAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=0 2021]) was endorsed by famous gay author [[Edmund White]], who has spoken positively of his own age-gap sex during youth. In this edition, Dollimore thinks back to his earliest sensual/sexual experience at "3 or 4 years old," concluding:

	::“I am still unsure whether Freudians are right in their insistence on the sexuality of the child, but I do know that the assumed innocence of the child is usually in the eye of the adult ~~beholder”~~ (p. 5, 2021).]		::"I am still unsure whether Freudians are right in their insistence on the sexuality of the child, but I do know that the assumed innocence of the child is usually in the eye of the adult beholder" (p. 5, 2021).]

	*'''[[Rachel Hope Cleves]], [http://library.lol/main/4FB01D8582CB462BF79D0CF28A43BF00 Unspeakable: A Life Beyond Sexual Morality] (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2020).'''		*'''[[Rachel Hope Cleves]], [http://library.lol/main/4FB01D8582CB462BF79D0CF28A43BF00 Unspeakable: A Life Beyond Sexual Morality] (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2020).'''